Remember this article? As per numerous polite suggestions from my beloved omni friends, it was requested I write an antipodal article from the omni perspective. As a vegan, I, of course, do not think I say anything annoying, so I had to do some field research on this one. Here are some annoying things vegans say to omnivores, what they may be trying to convey, and what they should say instead.
“That’s not vegan.”
Randomly telling someone the Gummi Bears they are eating are not vegan is offering unsolicited information, and the omni probably does not care because they already live an omnivore lifestyle (and they love gummy bears). Maybe you were just sharing a fun fact? Maybe you were trying to share something personal about yourself? Either way, you will catch more flies with agave syrup than you will with vinegar.
Vegan Rephrase: “What flavor is the white Gummy Bear? I was just curious because I actually do not eat Gummy Bears since they are not vegan.”
“Let’s go to Vegan Hut for dinner (again).”
While vegan restaurants probably suit your lifestyle perfectly, they can be a little limiting to an omnivore who is really craving a chicken caesar salad. This is not to say that omni friends/loved ones will not occasionally eat vegan cuisine (omnis may even end up loving baked seitan with a side of yucca mash and mushroom compote), but try finding an equilibrium and suggesting restaurants that serve an array of both omnivore and vegan dishes like Mexican food restaurants, Thai food restaurants, etc.
Vegan Rephrase: “You and I both love that Mexican/Thai/Chinese/Ethiopian/Japanese/Mediterranean/Etc. place around the corner. Would you want to go there for dinner?”
“That bloody steak looks disgusting.”
Some may argue that there is a delicate balance between sharing your beliefs with others, a sincere desire to influence change, and being a disruptive jerk. Omnis know meat comes from slaughtered animals – no need to remind them or interrupt a meal they are enjoying. Look away, enjoy your sesame tofu with vegetable fried rice, and be satisfied and proud that you are living vegan. Remember, a lifestyle change lasts longer when it is a person’s self-motivated decision rather than a product of guilt.
Vegan Rephrase: “I sometimes get uncomfortable with the sight of meat. I hope you are not offended, but I am going to sit over here instead. Let’s catch up over coffee later?”
“Your omelet has a soul.”
This often comes up in the vegan vs. vegetarian debate. Although the vegan policy on eggs is clear, you might want to consider egg-eating vegetarians as part of our meat-free family and grant them a seat at the breakfast table since, at the very least, they will not be eating bacon and sausage (which is two thirds of the battle). Go easy on your diet-like cousins.
Vegan Rephrase: “As a vegan, I do not eat eggs, but I am interested in hearing your take on the debate.”
“How can you drink that milkshake? You’ve stolen nourishment from a baby.”
You are passionate and zealous about your vegan lifestyle, but that does not mean you can realistically expect everyone around you to be vegan (at least not overnight) nor that you should isolate yourself from non-vegans. The bleeding heart card may work on some, but will make many not want to eat with you. Because eating is often a social and bonding activity, if you care to keep a congenial relationship with the dairy drinker, it’s best to pick your battles.
Vegan Rephrase: “As a vegan, I do not consume any dairy products, but I am interested in hearing your take on the debate.”
“I can’t eat that.”
While your devotion to your vegan lifestyle is admirable, you may unintentionally advertise it as fussy and onerous sometimes. If someone brings in a store-bought dairy and egg-filled white cake for a coworker’s birthday, just politely decline a piece; you won’t be the only one (for a plethora of reasons, e.g., dieting, diabetes, lactose intolerance) abstaining.
Vegan Rephrase: “Thank you for offering, but I’d prefer not to have any.”
“I’ll bring a vegan dish.”
They know. They invited you to the potluck and asked everyone to contribute something. Because you are vegan, they assume you will be bringing vegan food. Marketing it is redundant and unnecessary. Just seamlessly offer to bring a (vegan) dish as an ordinary potluck guest.
Vegan Rephrase: “Thanks for inviting me! I’m so excited!”
“I bet you didn’t know this was vegan.”
Maybe they did not, but who cares? It’s delicious, and they are gobbling it up. Revel in that!
Vegan Rephrase: Absolutely nothing!
As always, thank you for reading with an open mind and continuing to respect and coexist with your fellow man.
Michelle Cyr says
Lorilei’s artictles are always informative as well as pleasant to read. I look forward to each issue of vegaprocity.com.
the oncoming storm says
wow, a vegan who’s not hostile to omnivores. i salute you!
Brian Maida says
There are a lot more out there than you might know, although this is a common phenomenon, just as right wing republicans are hostile to progressives.
jojo says
and progressives being hostile to republicans. and assuming republican cannot be vegan/pagan/etc.
Brian Maida says
don’t want to turn this political, but sure progressives are hostile to republicans. When talking to most republicans, I find they are actually quite liberal when it comes to fairness, human rights and equality.
Andrew Staynor says
WHAT? Explain how right wing republicans are hostile towards ‘progressives’ – more likely to be the OTHER way around! And what makes anyone a ‘progressive’? I bet there isn’t a cohesive agreement amongst even ten so-called ‘progressives’ about what that even constitutes! Pffft!
Paul says
In my experience, it is the meat eaters (animal abusers) who ALWAYS start the aggression, and hostility towards Vegans.
NOT the other way around as you suggest.
Guest says
The other way round is there too. Mind sharing some with me? I find a bunch of articles where there’s always a bunch of said other way round,and start stopping both groups.
And I don’t think I need to say this,but meat eaters are not animal abusers.
Olivier Girardot says
Paul is right. We all had a non vegan life before we were vegan, we can compare. Can you ?
Chris says
My sister works at a natural health food store. A vegan customer was outraged because there was bees wax in the lip balm LOL. I found that so funny :)
Lorilei says
I’ve run into similar situations. I’ve learned that people have varying thresholds. I have friends who are vegan in all other aspects but eat honey (which isn’t technically vegan, it’s vegetarian), or will wear leather only if they buy it used at a thrift store (because it’s not directly supporting the animal slaughter industry). I’ve met a range of folks between the technical definition that devout lifestyle vegans follow, to those whose make individual lifestyle choices they are comfortable with.
Jinx77 says
I have a vegan friend who is so rude and annoying it makes me want to rip my hair out! I’ve been a vegetarian for 18 years, to me it’s a dietary choice that in no way defines me as a person and I couldn’t care less what others around me eat, as long as it makes them happy! My vegan friend takes it upon herself to preach at me not just for eating cheese but even the most trivial of things I like. Once she got angry at me because I had a cat calendar on my fridge because I am supporting the “exploitation of animals for profit”! The worst is when we go out on a day trip and she’ll waste my time wandering aimlessly around looking for a place that’s acceptable for her to eat. I’m happy to eat anywhere she chooses, but she never plans ahead which is annoying, especially when she contradicts herself with the classic passive aggressive: “I’m happy to eat anywhere, don’t worry about me” after she’s made us walk around for ages in search of a restaurant that fits her holier-than-thou moral standards. The worst is that she pretends to be a tolerant, non-preachy vegan without even realizing she is the epitome of the stereotype. It’s hard to be supportive of someone like this when they’re constantly looking for ways to “one-up” everyone around them to make themselves feel superior. If you’re a vegan good for you, it’s great you are passionate about something, but don’t be so judgmental about others!
Holly New says
I understand where you’re coming from. It’s hard when people unintentionally promote negative stereotypes about themselves, because it puts a bad rap on all people like that.
Olivier Girardot says
Your friend is just annoying. She would probably be as annoying if she ate meat…. and maybe even aggressive on top of that haha
Mark Ludas CPT says
I have found the wisdom of a lifestyle and the gratification it brings become more evident to other people the less time is spent “preaching” and the more time is spent educating, listening, and understanding. There is a time and place for radical rhetoric but not always in a friend’s kitchen; and how much of your vegan friend’s time is spent yelling at the meat companies, at the corrupt politicians to clean up their act and stop subsidizing these murderous polluting industries? Or is all of her vitriol reserved for her friends whom she knows will tolerate it?
Long story short, I hear you.
Bill says
Science, I hate vegans.
Olivier Girardot says
ok :)
Koji Watanabe says
So ditch them if they don’t shut up.
Why do people complain about friends who annoy the heck out of them, yet still hang out with them? Flat tell her to drop the passive aggressive preaching and tell her she is a walking stereotype and everyone thinks so.
Once you hit a certain age, you start cutting those sorts of people out of your life and surround yourself with people who make you happy if they don’t alter their behavior
Paul says
Jinxx77 – Your friend IS a better person than you. she at least is trying to show you that. she will probably just give up on you, as you clearly don’t care about anything or anyone other than yourself.
Lol says
No, their friend is NOT better than them. You types are so self righteous it’s pathetic. Now go pat yourself on the back.
Olivier Girardot says
Poor boy, you have got one big problem ! lol
But what about world hunger, the environment disaster and animal suffering that the meat and dairy industry is responsible for ? What are you doing a bout it ?
Jeff says
Aw man, you’re so selfish, trying to enforce your absurd views on other people. What about in the Arctic Circle where whale blubber is the only thing available to eat, or dried reindeer meat. How do you eat a plant based diet in the tundra? Go on, tell me, how do you do that? Your diet is based on choice that you are lucky enough to have because you live in a wealthy country. You don’t think of other people and live a self-absorbed existence where even grasping that there are other cultures in the world, places without malls and side walks is beyond your tiny perception of the whole of planet Earth.
Your whole vegan life style is backwards, you are not helping the Earth, organic can still be bad for the environment, the air miles of your food is contributing to climate change, forests are being cleared for mono-cultures of grains, vegetables, fruit and nuts. Irrigation is causing starvation and drought. The planet will suffer because of your plant based diet, just cos you feel bad for animals, well, animals are dying of thirst and starvation because of you. Wild animals are being shot and maimed and poisoned so farmers can protect their crops. Stop being so smug.
Olivier Girardot says
Selfish ?
Selfish is eating meat and dairy no matter the consequences, just because you like it. Read more, and inform yourself, you will find out that the vegan choice is the opposite of selfish.
Who said anything about Eskimos turning vegan ? They are not responsible for global warming. We are. And you more than me if you eat meat. Unless you live in the Tundra ? In that case, eat what you can, and not a single vegan will tell you otherwise.
Our plant based, organic, local and seasonal diet is much less harmful for the environment than yours. Possibly 20 times less, depending on how much meat and dairy you eat.
You don’t seem to know much about veganism do you ?
Jeff says
Not all vegan diets are created equal. You think shipping soy all around the world is better than eating fish or chicken produced 30 miles away?
Some people eat highly refined processed and packaged vegan food, is that better than an egg from 30 miles away?
Some vegan diets will contribute more than my diet to global warming. I don’t think all vegans eat organic, local and seasonal now do they? And by the way, organic doesn’t mean vegan, organic hoof and horn, organic bone meal, organic pesticides that persist in the soil, kill bees and soil fauna, and are highly toxic? Mmmmm, yum, copper sulphate. You don’t seem to know much about organic do you?
And yes, intensive factory farming contributes significantly towards global warming, I’m not denying that. But I choose not to eat meat and dairy produced in that way. As soon as I have to supplement B12, D, calcium and omega 3, I know I am not eating a healthy balanced diet. A little bit of meat and dairy never hurt anyone.
Olivier Girardot says
You know that the meat and dairy industry is the largest contributor to global warming, right ?
You know that the soy that is shipped from South America, where there used to be tropical forests, is shipped to feed your meat, not vegans.
Vegans eat local, including tofu,, like I said before….
But don’t take my word for it, look it up !
“A little bit of meat and dairy never hurt anyone”. That never was the point.
But as long as you eat a little bit of meat, and dairy, let’s say once a week, that’s fine. And as long as you chose local,and humane meat (whatever the hell that means), that’s fine. Do you make sure that the animals you eat have been treated and killed properly ? Because that’s far more complicated then being vegan :)
So you seem to be concerned about health ? There are no health issues when you are vegan. But who cares, we have already established that one doesn’t become vegan for his own personal health, but for much less self-centered reasons ;)
B12 is an interesting topic.. The bacteria found in soil are the source of vitamin B12, and we get it by eating a little dirt on vegetables, or by eating animals who did the same thing. Because plants are more thoroughly washed now, we no longer get as much B12 from plants. Nor do the animals you eat. They are supplemented.
What is the big deal again ?
This whole B12 is just another pretext for people like you to pretend (or convince themselves) that they “need” to eat meat, and that they are not contributing to global warming, just for a pleasure.
You eat meat because you like it.
Jeff says
I would be interested to see the evidence for meat and dairy being the biggest contributor to green house gas emissions? Where are you getting this from, what is your proof? Because, actually it is the energy and heat production sector. This is true, globally and in the US, so stop spouting your misinformation.
And please tell me where a vegan would find local tofu in Germany? And by the way, there are still tropical forests in South America….they’re not all gone yet. I am not condoning deforestation to feed livestock. Animals should graze and forage as is their natural behaviour.
It’s not just B12, there are other vitamins and minerals and trace elements not found in plants that contribute to a healthy body and mind, which you have conveniently glossed over, as well as organic farming practices.
I eat a little meat and dairy because it is good for a varied diet. I am not a nutrisionist but I do know omega 3 keeps my brain working and iron helps with the absorption of oxygen in the blood. I don’t know anyone personally who eats more grams of meat than veg in a week, that wouldn’t be good for the body. And not everyone can be healthy on a vegan diet.
Is it self-centered to want to be healthy? That is a very strange thing to say. So what exactly are your reasons for being vegan?
Olivier Girardot says
Well, yes, it’s a self centered choice to eat for pleasure and your own health over global warming.
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2016/mar/21/eat-less-meat-vegetarianism-dangerous-global-warming
http://edition.cnn.com/2015/09/29/opinions/sutter-beef-suv-cliamte-two-degrees/
http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/climate-change/study-claims-meat-creates-half-of-all-greenhouse-gases-1812909.html
https://taifun-tofu.de/en/bringing-soybean-to-europe
You can find anything you need in a plant based diet, without any effort. Sure, you should pay attention to what you eat, whether you eat meat or not.
By the way, how can you be sure you don”t have any deficiencies ? B12 for example are you certain you have enough intake ? Are you sure that the meat you buy has been supplemented enough ?
Because I know I get everything I need :)
So your point is that you eat meat to be healthy. But you could be as healthy without the meat, and without the global warming effects or the animal suffering… I don’t get it.
Unless the main reason you eat meat is simply because you like it… and fuck the rest.
Olivier Girardot says
Ok, apparently my comment is awaiting moderation, so here it is again, without the F word at the end lol:
Well, yes, it’s a self centered choice to eat for pleasure and your own health over global warming.
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2016/mar/21/eat-less-meat-vegetarianism-dangerous-global-warming
http://edition.cnn.com/2015/09/29/opinions/sutter-beef-suv-cliamte-two-degrees/
http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/climate-change/study-claims-meat-creates-half-of-all-greenhouse-gases-1812909.html
https://taifun-tofu.de/en/bringing-soybean-to-europe
You can find anything you need in a plant based diet, without any effort. Sure, you should pay attention to what you eat, whether you eat meat or not.
By the way, how can you be sure you don”t have any deficiencies ? B12 for example are you certain you have enough intake ? Are you sure that the meat you buy has been supplemented enough ?
Because I know I get everything I need :)
So your point is that you eat meat to be healthy. But you could be as healthy without the meat, and without the global warming effects or the animal suffering… I don’t get it.
Unless the main reason you eat meat is simply because you like it… and F the rest.
Olivier Girardot says
My comment bounced because I am not allowed to post links.
Yes it is self centered to be healthy if it means destroying the planet and torturing animals. If what you do has negative consequences on other peoples’ lives, but you still do it, than it’s selfish.
Is enjoying driving fast selfish ? Well if it’s on a public road yes, but on a racing track no.
Eating healthy is not the issue, it’s how you do it.
But seriously, you never heard about the livestock, which means the meat and dairy industry, being the major contributor to global warming ?
There are tons of articles out there, but you can start by typing :”Livestock a major threat to environment”, and you should find an article from the FAO.from … 2008… so it’s not really a news flash.
You can also check the tofu brand Taifun. Their production process is explained ;)
Try typing taifun tofu DE in google, you’ll find the website. There is an English translation… you’ll figure it out.
“I eat a little meat and dairy because it is good for a varied diet” That’s just BS.
Every nutrients you need, you can find them in plants. You can have the exact same varied diet without the meat and dairy…. or cholesterol and osteoporosis ;)
My reasons for being vegan ? 95% environmental, 5% animal suffering.
But that is a very good question, thank you for asking. Let me go into details a little bit.
The environmental reason is an obvious one. Everyone is urged to reduce his/her meat consumption. If everyone would reduce by 80% we would be fine. By the way, the more vegans there are, the less efforts meat eaters have to make. We are happy to do more than our part ;)
After drastically reducing my meat and dairy consumption, I thought organic products were free of all animal suffering. WRONG ! There is actually no way of knowing if the animals you eat have been treated and killed properly. So I am not taking the chance of eating or wearing pain and suffering, just for pleasure.
Unlike most meat eaters, the meat eater I was admitted that we only eat meat and wear leather for pleasure in modern countries. I am not talking about remote places, they are not responsible for global warming or animal suffering.
But that is probably the little detail that makes the difference: acknowledging we only eat animal products for pleasure. No other reason but pleasure. When you realize that, you can’t live with yourself knowing how much pain and suffering is in your plate.
By the way the future of meat, is lab grown meat. In a few years it’s going to hit the market. It’s so much easier and less costly to produce, it’s a huge potential for the food industry. And the food industry will find a way to put this meat in your plates one way or another if it means big bucks. That’s what they do ;)
Olivier Girardot says
I just found an interesting piece from 2 days ago, about lab meat.
Type: “Who’s afraid of lab-grown meat? Root for this innovation to be on our plates soon”
And look for the article from the NY daily news (dot com).
You’ll also find facts about the impact of animal farming on the environment:
“With conventional animal products accounting for 70% of global water consumption, 40% of land use, and 15% of the world’s greenhouse gas emissions, cultured meat could help us conserve our limited resources, stem the loss of biodiversity, and mitigate climate change. In fact, analyses suggest that growing cultured meat could reduce land and water use — as well as greenhouse gas emissions — by a whopping 90%.”
Isn’t that cool ?
Elaine Williams says
Why on earth do you hang around with this person?
Andrew says
“Maybe they did not, but who cares? It’s delicious, and they are gobbling it up. Revel in that!”
What do you mean “who cares”?
If someone who is not a vegan found the vegan food delicious, it might be easier for them to consider that leap.. I know tons of people who are not vegans or vegetarians but do desire to be vegans one day!
And some things holding them back is, they don’t know how to make good food, or “will the food be good”?
So if it was delicious, and you let them know it was vegan, then they’ll be like “whoa, really? Maybe I won’t be missing out if I do go vegan”
Perhaps it could be rephrased to:
Vegan Rephrase: “Delicious vegan items like this makes being a vegan easier. :)”
A lot of people live to eat, rather than eat to live. So if they know there are still delicious foods on the other side, they’d be more inspired to take action.
Steph says
You could also offer them the recipe for the foods that they’re enjoying so much! It’s nice to keep that sort of thing handy, just in case – vegan, or otherwise!
Scott says
Hello! This is my first post here! (I’m a non-vegan, but I’m a curious chap, and I stumbled across this nifty article. It’s kind of refreshing to see this kind of website having open arms views!)
That said, in the comment “Who cares,” I read it as if there was an implication that the person involved didn’t already want to be vegan (or didn’t express a desire to be).
In that case, I mean no offense, but I believe the ‘Who’ is the person eating the gummy bears. The only times I ever really get bothered by another persons lifestyle is when they believe I *should* care. Perhaps, in some things, we should care more. The trick is, though, as a non-vegan, I don’t really care whether my gummy bears are vegan (they’re delicious, and I love them).
I’m not sure how everyone else views things, but for me, I do enjoy sharing recipes, though! I’ve had vegan dishes that I’ve thoroughly enjoyed. I feel bad, as a non-vegan, that I can’t share many recipes (and sometimes lament the work involved in finding out if one I want to share is vegan friendly)!
I’m not sure if it matters to you, or if this is precisely the right spot, but I believe that the response “What do you MEAN who cares!?” is precisely why some people don’t… coexist well with some vegans. It can often feel like a religious preacher has come to my door. I know you feel strongly, but I don’t. It doesn’t mean I haven’t thought about it.
I’ve noticed that, at least for the vocal vegans, it seems that there’s a perspective that I *would* care, if only I thought about it, or saw it your way. I don’t think that’s really true, but is instead a fallacy of logical reasoning. I wonder if there isn’t a little more learning we could all do to make the world a happier place?
Anyhew! I hope I didn’t offend anyone, particularly with my first post. It’s great to see these articles getting around, for both vegans and non vegans alike!
Paul says
Do you love the flavour? or the ingredients?
The ingredients contain dead animal parts. You can eat alternatives. You say you don’t care. OK fine, then no-one will care about you.
Olivier Girardot says
The problem is, “I don”t care” isn’t good enough for so many reasons.
If slavery was still at thing in your country, and that you would constantly and willingly buy items made by slaves, we would be totally right to tell you that what you are doing is wrong.
You could keep on saying that you don’t care, but I don’t see any reason why I should stop fighting against slavery just because people like you don’t care. On the contrary !
And here, we are not only talking about the exploitation, torture and killing of sentient beings, let’s not forget about global warming.
Every time you eat a piece of meat it has an impact on me, my future, and future generations who don’t diverse to pick up your mess.
I am not trying to convince you. I am just saying that the fact that you don’t care doesn’t exempt you of being criticized for your choices that involves the rest of us.
Jeff says
I’ll ask again, where is your proof that meat and dairy production contributes most to global warming?
Where do all the nutrients come from for a healthy mind and body?
Where have I said ‘I don’t care’, I’ve said intensive farming is never good.
Finally, if you have to resort to comparing the horrific mistreatment of people to further your activism- instead of relying on the actual welfare issues of animals in captivity-you clearly do not know enough about the cause you are campaigning for. A common theme in your posts.
Olivier Girardot says
This is not the same conversation, I was replying to someone else.
My reply to you, didn”t seem to get through, so I will write a new response.
Olivier Girardot says
Actually the reply to your comment I wrote yesterday is there. Go up to the previous conversation, you will find it.
Olivier Girardot says
Apparently my comment is awaiting moderation… I’ll post it here if it doesn’t get through.
Olivier Girardot says
Actually, it’s because of the links you asked for… but since the OP is from september 2014, I wonder if someone is still moderating this thread.
We’ll see…
Guest says
There’s no reply button for some of yours posts…that’s weird.
It’s a good thing Jeff stopped replying to you though. Mostly because you can’t be bothered with :)
Guest says
There’s no reply button for some of your posts…that’s weird.
It’s a good thing Jeff stopped replying to you though. Mostly because you can’t be bothered with :)
Olivier Girardot says
Haha, paranoid ;)
Jenna says
Andrew – I’m an omnivore, and I would find the “I bet you didn’t know this was vegan” comment deeply, deeply annoying, and would be further put off veganism by it. “I bet you didn’t know” /anything/ is generally not a good way to introduce information and keep people on side, it reads as smug. There’s nothing wrong with sharing tasty vegan food with people, or telling them it’s vegan if they ask, but if you deliberately only tell them it’s vegan after they eat it to prove your point – that will make your friend feel manipulated.
Man. As much as I understand that a passionate commitment to your cause means you want to share it, I’m amazed that anybody needs to be told that it’s “annoying” to tell your friends their food is disgusting, or guilt-trip somebody over their meal.
Olivier Girardot says
Unless their food is a dead corpse… ;)
Chelsea M says
Oliver, that phrase is not constructive for anyone. It gets very tiring hearing vegans tell omnivores about their “dead corpse” dinner- even if it is a joke.. It’s so very played out.
Olivier Girardot says
It’s funny no one ever told me I was eating a dead corpse in over 30 years of meat eating. And you say you hear it all the time ?
But on the other hand, in one year of being vegan, I have been experiencing an incomparable amount of hostility from some meat eaters while they complain about aggressive vegans … how strange.
So why is so disturbing to you the idea of eating a dead corpse? That’s exactly what you do.
Aaron says
Maybe you get the hostile treatment because of saying weird things like “dead corpse” when someone is eating. Oh, and you ate meat for 30 years and then went vegan for a year, and now your going to bash people for eating meat. Lol. Wtf. BTW every vegan I ever met was painfully annoying. Like hanging out with a born again christian.
Olivier Girardot says
Oh poor little princess, harassed by vegans, lol.
So what, I call meat a dead corpse ? Can’t handle that ? Sure that’s a bit provocative, but on the other hand it’s true. But you don’t want to hear about it right ?
What is actually annoying to you is not that I am calling meat a dead corpse, it’s the fact that it actually is, and you don’t want to be reminded. Why so ?
When vegans remind you about the dramatic impact of the meat and dairy industry on the environment, what’s annoying to you is the fact that it’s true and that you know you are contributing to it. But instead of facing that, you prefer ignoring it and blame the vegans for telling you.
If vegans are annoying, they have every right to be, and you should just accept it. When you eat meat, it has an impact on me, and my children. So it’s only fair man ! And if you think I am annoying, well, who cares really.
When I realized the dramatic degradation of our environment, the billions of animals tortured (not raised, tortured), the populations dying of hunger for our satisfaction, I was annoyed yes. But not by those who chose to step up. I was annoyed by at the industry who created this mess and forced a frenetic meat and dairy consumption on us, while lying to our faces.
So instead of being complacent and whining about vegans making me feel bad, Well I was honest with myself, I admitted to myself that I was feeling bad about contributing to the mess,
I don’t really get people like you. If the boat you are in is sinking. Would you let it sink because you thought that the people who told you how to stop it from sinking were annoying ?
Well anyway, if you are annoyed now, be prepared to be increasingly more annoyed in the next years and for the rest of your life, until you finally have the balls to acknowledge the problem.
LUIS MATAMOROS V. says
Oliver the fact that you call it a dead corpse does not affect me and I think a lot of omnivores one bit. We know it’s a dead animal and it tastes fucking amazing. The reason it doesn’t help is because it promotes the stereotype of a preachy obnoxious vegan douchebag. And yes it “affects you and your children”…So does driving your car or turning on any electronic device…Would you stop driving or typing on your computer if someone started chiming in “you are making holes in the ozone you know”…It’s true, but it’s not information that was solicited or even relevant…You need to get from a to b, you need to use your computer…To omnivores it’s the same thing…I acknowledge the problem I just don’t give a fuck because the inmediate need is more important. You went vegan, congrats, don’t expect us to do so, even with your obnoxious commentary. Hell, the only reason there’s an issue with production is because it had to become industrialized to support the overpopulation of humans on earth…so by your logic you should even be bugging pregnant women saying something along the lines of “You know it’s one more mouth for the planet to feed.” or “There’s too many of us already.” It’s part of the problem no?
PS. I’ve been to the farms and slaughterhouses where my meat and dairy come from, they are green ecological and I have not seen any animal cruelty at all so roll that whole torture line in rice paper and eat it…I do NOT promote the reckless destruction of the environment or any type of animal abuse
Olivier Girardot says
@Luis Matamoros
” the fact that you call it a dead corpse does not affect me”. That is what you claim. But studies show, and most people admit to it, that there is a huge gap between the meat and the animal in people’s mind. I am not inventing it, you can find it very easily. This is part of the things I read about before becoming vegan. And as you can see, I was a meat eater before, and I remember. You can’t foul us that easily ;)
When a normal person starts really looking into it, watching how animals suffer and how they are killed, eviscerated, etc etc, that doesn’t make them hungry at all !
A lot of people, like I used to, don’t eat a piece of dead animal, they eat meat. In our society, everything is done to make the consumer forget that the meat you eat is a dead animal. Of course you know it’s a dead animal when you think about it, but the thing is, you never think about it. Not when you buy it, not when you eat it.
Except you of course, and all the meat eaters I have this discussion with (on the internet), you are different somehow. In real life I meet what I want to call the more honest meat eaters.
And if you truly don’t care that you are eating a dead animal, your reaction isn’t qualified as “standard” according to those studies. People feeling indifferent in front of the death of an animal killed for his own pleasure, isn’t a good sign… So I am hoping that you aren’t 100% fine with that idea.
“it tastes fucking amazing” now that is the interesting part of your comment, because it is that ! But ONLY that. And that’s the problem. As soon as you realize the huge stakes that are involved in a simple pleasure of yours (that most of the planet can’t even share with you), you can’t just ignore it.
Also, it tastes good only because you are used to it. You like meat by habit, because you have been eating it since you are a kid. Period. If you stopped eating meat, a couple of months later, you wouldn’t even care for the taste of meat.
It is also an addiction, especially with bacon and shit like that. And cheese is even worse, there are addictive agents in cheese that you find in highly addictive drugs. I can tell you, stopping meat is easy. Cheese, not so much ! But who wants to be addicted anyway.
“stereotype of a preachy obnoxious vegan douchebag” I don’t think any vegan will care about what you think of them. This is just your pretext for not giving a fuck. Blaming vegans for not becoming one ? That is so weak bullshit.. I think it’s douche bag by the way. 2 words.
“overpopulation of humans” that’s crap. The problem is over consumption, including the over consumption of meat. Again, I am not inventing this, it’s a FACT. Blaming over population is another weak excuse for doing nothing: “it’s not my fault, it’s all those people so there is nothing I can do about it”. Ridiculous.
The rest it’s basically you whining about how everything is not your fault and how it’s too hard for you to make any kind of effort and finding excuses for yourself. None of this is relevant.
Yes you should take your bike instead of the car as much as possible. Transport is the second most important cause of global warming. Of course, in many cases, it’s technically impossible to never use a car. Unlike stopping eating meat, which is totally within every body’s reach in development countries. Some people depend on animal consumption, but not you !
You are required to do everything else you can do to stop this nonsense of useless over consumption craziness. The future generations depend on us. What are you going to say in 30 years: “I didn’t give a fuck because it was inconvenient for me” ?
No, you will probably lie, and say that you were part of the resistance from the beginning, right ?
“I’ve been to the farms and slaughterhouses” your own little personal experience is irrelevant. 90% at least of farming and slaughterhouse are places of tremendous pain distress and misery. Read the fucking facts instead of going to the nice little farms with the happy pigs and then convincing yourself that global warming and animal suffering doesn’t exist.
Don’t pretend that you only eat meat from animals that have been treated properly and killed humanely (whatever that means), because, again according to studies, that doesn’t exist. You might eat sometimes this kind of meat, but most of the time you contribute to mass pain and suffering.
When you go to the restaurant or to a friend’s place for dinner, do you ask if the animal was treated properly ?
Wolf Eeter says
Let me guess…
I’m going to use my magic sorcery powers to predict you are either Mormon or Christian…
Paul says
Olivier – Well said.
Meat = a word made up by the Meat industry, to cover up the truth of what it actually is: Tortured, Tormented and Murdered Sentient Beings.
Luis – You sound like a psychopath. “just don’t give a fuck” OK, stick your head back up your arse where it has been all your life, and where it belongs.
Kellie says
Meat isn’t a made up word from the meat industy to cover up the truth. You get an A+ for being a sensationalist though.
‘Meat’ is derived from the Old English word ‘Mete’ which meant food, all food, not just flesh. If you’d care to check your facts, maybe I could take you more seriously.
Paul says
Wow. You got me there!! Your so clever!! HA!
Excuse monger.
Kellie says
Ha ha yeah. We’re so funny with our language games and thinking about things reasonably.
Kathleen Bürger says
Oliver and Paul. Your comments made me hungry for meat…which I slaughtered and butchered myself. The thought of you both while I was eating was so erotic that I had to knock one out half way through my rare rump steak! I’ll be thinking about you guys again while knocking one out after my fry up, complete with black pudding ( that’s congealed pigs blood and fat for anyone that doesn’t know. It’s gooooood! And it’s much more satisfying when you’ve raised those animals yourself)
So, thanks again for helping me not turn vegan. You guys are real pals. And vegetables taste so much better when they’re served smothered in butter, instead of unwarranted self importance and sanctimony.
Lomedin says
I wish more vegans said to omnivores what you claim they say!
Honestly, I’m tired of politeness and “excuse me for being vegan” behaviour.
Paul says
Me too.
Keep it to the facts. It is incredulous, how many lies people have (been sold and) bought.
Elaine Williams says
Just stop fucking announcing it every chance you get – that is what makes you annoying.
Olivier Girardot says
15000 scientists recently released a manifesto about global warming in which they urge people to adopt and promote a plant based diet.
Hundreds of scientific studies warn us about the impact that animal farming has on the environment,and world hunger. Not to mention the unbearable torture that is inflicted to billions of animals every single day.
And that’s what’s is annoying you ? Let me get something straight. Considering the importance of the issue and the way humans is destroying nature in general, nobody gives a flying fuck if we are annoying to a minority of people like you.
If that’s the only argument anti-vegans have against us, well you are not going to go very far in this debate, and you should get ready to get even more annoyed in the coming months and years !!! It’s only the beginning of an amazing and beautiful global movement.
.And at least I am doing something about it. At least my kids and my grand kids will know that I did everything I could to leave them a better place. Whereas your children and grand children will know that you didn’t give a fuck about leaving them a huge toxic waste for a planet.
By far, I’d rather be annoying than a selfish bitch.
Niko says
A vegan with degrees in gerontology.. Useless on all fronts. Going to slam down this bomb 14 oz. New York strip I reckon! Boy oh boy!
Olivier Girardot says
Your comment, on the other hand, is so useful. Thank you :)
Paul says
Enjoy the cancer.
Guest says
Enjoy your pesticide.
Olivier Girardot says
What ?
Lilie says
Why does there need to be a debate period!? You shared you are vegan, the why’s and why not’s, so just eat your veggies and zip-it. This is no different than having one’s right to their sexual orientation, religious beliefs or political views. What people eat is there choice and right so back off!!!! Once is enough,pushy, righteous people!!! Plus your veggies grew in cow manure and some are fungi so let’s not critic each other’s choices. : )
Olivier Girardot says
Oh but it’s very, VERY different. Your sexual orientation or whether you smoke or not has no affect on anyone else (unless you blow your smoke in people’s face). BUT the meat and dairy industry is killing our planet and everyone on it ! Man, there is a debate and it’s becoming bigger and bigger and it’s not about to stop. This industry, and therefore everyone participating in it’s flourishing, is a huge problem for ALL of us.
I encourage you to read more about the subject.
Aldo says
Okay..
This is the same thing the article is talking about, you’re trying to make omnivores feel guilty about their dietary choices. Bringing in the whole environmental issue is putting yourself into a holier-than-thou attitude that is annoying and contributes nothing to your cause.
It seems that is a lose-lose situation when it comes to vegans. Some days ago I was watching a Youtube video where the ‘Tuber’ asked about what you could consider a fashion faux-pas and a vegan said ‘leather jackets’ and added some moralistic comment. It was about fashion faux pas, dammit! But it seems like some vegans like to pull the ‘morally-higher-than-you-card’ every so often…and then they act like victims. That’s a big no-no and makes you look like complete assholes that instead of drawing empathy towards veganism only create spite towards it.
I honestly liked this article and I wish I could know more respectful vegans since I have some questions regarding veganism, but it seems like the most loud and obnoxious, like you Oliver, are the most preponderant type around.
Olivier Girardot says
Honestly, my comment, is purely factual. I can’t say ” the meat and dairy industry is killing our planet and everyone on it “, more politely than that.
There is nothing obnoxious about stating a fact. If I tell you that you will drown if you stay too long under water, you will call me obnoxious ?
What’s obnoxious, is ignoring a fact ;)
And what is wrong with having an opinion on the use of leather in the fashion industry ? It’s totally valid and in the topic. I think you are being a bit picky here.
Anyway, if you have questions, I would be happy to try to give you answers.
Mike says
Hey just because you have guilt in your dietary choice and you can’t take a little criticism doesn’t mean vegans feel holier than thou. The truth is what you should be in search of and look into veganism and not just blow it off because it clashes with your beliefs now. Just be opened minded and willing to learn something new instead of being so defensive like us vegans are out to get you or put you down about your lifestyle, we’re just trying to show the light to new ways of living guilt free and conscious.
Paul says
Hi Aldo. You will find lots of friendly Vegans willing and happy to help you with your questions about Veganism, and how you can get there.
First you need to educate yourself – not by watching a YT channel made by an animal abuser!! lol.
Everyone says
I encourage you to shut the fuck up.
Animal husbandry might be a disproportionately large source of greenhouse gas emissions, but the effect that they have had or will have in the future is far from fact. Saying it is killing the planet and everyone on it is at best an un-testable hypothesis.
Having an opinion is great, but frankly most people don’t care. Your entitled to your opinion, but voicing it and then acting superior to everyone who disagrees with you is being a douche.
My opinion is that disparaging people for partaking in a diet that the human body evolved/was created to need as a source of essential nutrients is stupid. But every-time I meet a vegan or eat a meal I don’t feel the need to let everyone around me know. You know why? Because its annoying.
-Everyone.
Olivier Girardot says
Oh poor little princess, harassed by vegans, lol.
What is actually annoying to you is knowing I’m right. Of course I am, it’s all facts ! I am not inventing anything. It’s not an opinion, is facts ! Look around, read, educate yourself and you will find out that the meat and dairy industry are the worst source of pollution on the planet and on every level.
If you are annoyed now, be prepared to be increasingly more annoyed in the next years and for the rest of your life, until you finally have the balls to acknowledge the problem.
Durd says
You seem like you’re trying to compensate for something that a vegan diet cannot fix….
Olivier Girardot says
@Durd
So you make stuff up about people, and than you don’t allow people to respond. That says a lot about you…
Guest says
So you type a bunch of responses,and don’t allow them response. Hmmm.
Olivier Girardot says
Hey Colombo, you are onto something mmhh…
No, actually you can reply, you just need to reply to the OP, that’s the way it works on this blog, don’t ask me way.
But it was funny to see how suspicious this made you in a few of your comments haha !
Anyway, is there anything interesting you wanted to say ? ’cause you spent Xmas eve writing something like 15 comments, but non of them are relevant.
Oh, and no canines have never been a proof of anything. It’s just some kind of rumor people like you like to use as “proof”, but it’s irrelevant.
Paul says
Dear “Everyone”……..
It is not an opinion it is FACT.
https://www.beforetheflood.com/explore/the-crisis/primary-causes/
Lots of Love.
all the Vegans, the people who are kind and compassionate.
Also see:
http://www.cowspiracy.com
http://www.howdoigovegan.com
There are many more resources. Educate your self. don’t remain ignorant.
Guest says
Holier than thou attitude indeed..
no chill says
I feel like the more appropriate rephrasing to most of these would be to just not say anything, no one wants to start a discussion on why they eat the foods they eat. If you can’t get through a meal with a non-vegan without prodding them into a debate, then maybe you need to put as much effort into improving your personality as you do into your diet.
Olivier Girardot says
“If you can’t get through a meal with a non-vegan without prodding them into a debate”
That is never, ever how it goes. It’s the other way around.
You would know that if you had already eaten with a vegan. It’s ALWAYS the meat eaters who start questioning the vegan, wanting to know why he doesn’t eat meat and fish and blablabla. And then the meat eaters explain why it’s natural to eat meat, and talk about the canines, evolution and blablabla
Meanwhile, the vegan wished HE could eat peacefully, hoping this conversation never started.
fallenangel30 says
Olivier Girardot — Please allow me to correct you. 99% of the vegans I’ve met are assholes. I am being harassed and insulted by a vegan who imagines herself superior to me, on Youtube, I made a simple comment, and she started insulting my personal beliefs, my personality, intelligence and belittling me as a woman. Telling me “You are a first class idiot __________ and a complete shame to the female gender, with your selfish, non nurturing, non sensitive nature. I can’t wait for women like you to be phased out of the gene pool … and it will happen.”
Does this sound like a happy go lucky, friendly vegan to you?
Olivier Girardot says
“99% of the vegans I’ve met are assholes”
You are very unlucky, lol
And I see you have met and interacted with over 100 vegans in order to make that statistic… wow that’s a lot. I only know like 4 or 5. And 100% of them are very nice people ;)
But then you only speak about 1 vegan, harassing you on… youtube !
First of all, you don’t don’t have to comment, or reply to other comments, or even read the fucking comments. That is not harassment ! This is ridiculous dude !
And you are a little sensitive.
Listen man, get over it, it’s really nothing. In your place I would be embarrassed if I complained about that. I have read and heard far worse then that. But I am not stupid enough to generalize based on one single Youtube exchange.
Guest says
You’re ridiculous because you just dismissed harassment. And the person probably only described one exchange. Telling the person to not comment when she has the rights to do so…rather counterproductive. Why let someone like the person she got harnessed with to restrict what she wants to do? Sure,she technically gave a comment,and that WOULD be commented on. But I imagine “You are a first class idiot __________ and a complete shame to the female gender, with your selfish, non nurturing, non sensitive nature. I can’t wait for women like you to be phased out of the gene pool … and it will happen.” should be flagged. You being so dismissive like that…irks me a lot. If you don’t know why,well,theres definitely something wrong with you @oliver
janx says
What if people who fight over colored people’s rights stopped advocating what they fight for ?
What if gay people started keeping to themselves again and hiding their sexuality ?
What if the anti-nazi groups like the french resistance kept to themselves instead of helping jews (and other minorities) ?
Being vegan is not a diet, it’s a fight for the environment and animal rights, a fight for those without a voice and although i agree that some vegans act all high and mighty and end up annoying everyone around them, people need to realize how frustrating it is for a vegan to look around and see everyone willingly participate on the torture and deaths of millions of animals per day.
I don’t like to annoy others but sometimes it’s a necessary evil to try and fight the animal holocaust. We only live once and some animals actually spend their lives trapped without moving and without ever seeing the sun for one second, they’ll never play with their brothers and sisters, they’ll never be free to run and jump and go and eat what they want, they will know only pain because of US.
We skin animals alive, we eat brains off of live monkeys, we test on animals, we force animals to be locked in cages all their lives… isnt all this worth fighting for ?
I bet that like me every vegan and vegetarian wishes they could eat whatever they want and wishes this endless fight to just stop but that’s not gonna happen overnight so what choice do we have but to keep fighting ?
Im sorry if we annoy you but being annoyed is far less worse than being in constant pain waiting to be put down and eaten unnecessarily
Crystal Peta says
Ok, you’re fighting for what you believe in. I assume the goal of your fight is to (in the words of vegans I know) “convert” omnivores, right? So, why on earth would you want to annoy the people you’re preaching to? Did you miss the “catch more flies with agave syrup” part?
No one likes to have their lifestyle criticised by their friends, no one likes to be preached to piously, no one likes to be harassed. No one wants to be bombarded with unsolicited scientific research or case studies. If someone asks (ASKS) you about your diet/lifestyle, then by all means, go ahead. But forcing yourself aggressively upon someone who is just going about living their life? Even when you’ve been asked to please refrain from discussing food? That is what an omnivore finds off putting and obnoxious about vegans.
I know from personal experience that the unrelenting harassment from vegans wanting to convert me has turned me from someone who happily and actively supports others in their pursuit of finding happiness through veganism, to someone who cringes and fights the urge to run and hide when I hear someone declare that they’re even a vegetarian. I’m gonna take a wild guess and assume I’m not the only person who feels this way. Now, wouldn’t it be more beneficial for your cause if, I dunno, you guys didn’t end up alienating everyone who doesn’t eat exactly the same way as you?
A lot of people may who may not want to become vegans might still be interested in helping you protest against, say, the leather industry, or might be curious about becoming a vegetarian, or even just might have questions about whether cutting down on their meat consumption might improve their health – all of these things being small but still positive changes in your eyes, right? Well, they’re not going to ask a judgemental and preachy person who makes them feel awful about even being alive about these things, are they? In fact, they’re more likely to remove you from their friendship circle (because let’s face it, someone who bullies and judges others relentlessly isn’t exactly a great friend!) – for their own emotional wellbeing – and form a negative opinion about vegans instead.
Give being non-judgemental a try. Don’t force your opinions on innocent bystanders around you. Go one week without preaching to someone. Just live your supposedly superior lifestyle in peace (and leave others in peace). I guarantee people will respect you far more and probably will even end up coming to you to open up a (non judgemental) dialogue about your diet/cause/lifestyle.
If nothing else, vegans behaving nicely will help dispel the negative image people have of the vegan movement – which is what you want, right?
Olivier Girardot says
Basically what you are saying is: The destruction of our planet, the billions of animals being tortured everyday, the thousands of people suffering from malnutrition and dying of hunger every year because of our meat consumption. aren’t strong enough arguments to compensate how annoying vegans are to you ? Aren’t you being a little picky ?
From my experience, the “vegans are annoying argument” is just another pretext to avoid the real topic,
“unrelenting harassement”, yeah I am pretty sure that is an exageration. And from my experience, it’s the other way around. Every time I have the conversation about veganism it’s non-vegan people who start it. I have to constently explain and justify myself. I avoid saying I am vegan unless I can’t do otherwise, and I am the one being harrassed and judged.
But here is the good news, you can find a lot of information on that topic on the internet. Here is one link I looked up for you: http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2010/jun/02/un-report-meat-free-diet
It’s a bit dated (2010) but more than ever valid, and you shouldn’t find that it’s “unrelenting harassement” ;)
You should also watch “Cowspiracy”, check it out it’s pretty interesting.
And here is a funny one addressing only the water consumption aspect of the meat industry, which is just a small part of the problem by the way: http://www.treehugger.com/green-food/how-many-showers-would-you-skip-help-beef-industry.html
On last thing. Don’t blame the messenger, we are not the problem ;)
Crystal Peta says
Actually when you have FB inbox messages sent to you every few days, when you’re tagged in Instagram posts about how great it is to live solely on bananas and potatoes, when you have books and DVDs sent to your house, when you’re told to stop seeing your GP and contact a controversial doctor on the Internet, when you can’t have a conversation with your friend without them trying to change your lifestyle – yeah, that does constitute unrelenting harassment.
Oh yeah, I’ve been sent multiple links to that cow thing, too. And Earthlings.
Don’t shoot the messenger? I didn’t, I just asked the messenger to please, for the sake of our friendship, please refrain from discussing food with me. She refused. So I had to cut the messenger out of my life.
Look at it this way – I’m religious. But I never try to convert my non religious friends. If I did, they would have every right to smack me out (after asking me to stop, of course). When I pointed out to vegan ex-friend that I did not impose my beliefs upon her, her response was “you can’t possibly be comparing something as stupid as Jesus to something as important as not eating animals!!” – what a way to be respectful of others, right? (Bear in mind that at no point had I ever denigrated her beliefs, in fact I had actually been super happy for her, that she was happy with her new life).
If the messenger was less like a Jehovas Witness who refuses to leave your doorstep, and more like an actual sane person, others would be more inclined to listen. Remember – you catch more flies with agave…
(Oh, and ironically, I have this year become mostly vegetarian, sometimes pescacarian – no it’s not vegan but I’m no longer “killing” over 300gms of animal per day, so that’s a start, right? And I can’t share that with her – and if I did, I know I still would be disappointing her).
Olivier Girardot says
“Actually when you have FB inbox messages sent to you every few days, when you’re tagged in Instagram posts about how great it is to live solely on bananas and potatoes”
I stopped reading after that, this never happens. Unless you subscribed to 100 vegan feeds ?
Remember one thing. All vegans were meat eaters. We remember how it was. And what you are describing isn’t even a tiny bit close to what I have ever experienced as a meat eater, and it was less than 2 years ago. I hadn’t even met a vegan then. Or maybe I did, but they never told me ;)
Guest says
You’re quite dismissive of what people say,aren’t you.
In which case,people should probably ignore you since you never read properly.
Amy says
If you’re fighting for the environment then Instead of preaching about a diet, why don’t you state the main cause for this environmental problem and that is human overpopulation? That’s the #1 problem we have so instead of telling people to change their diet, tell them to not spit out so many babies that the planet is straining to provide for.
Olivier Girardot says
No, overpopulation is not the cause of climate change, it’s over-consumption. And the number one products that harm the planet are ….(drum roll)… animal products !
Overpopulation is just an excuse for some people to say: “not my fault, there is nothing I can do about it”. Of course when the time comes for them to have kids, they forget about that.
Plus, since western countries are those that consume and pollute the most, logically, that’s where the population should stop growing. Because it won’t change much if you ask India or Africa to stop having children…
But you know what, let’s not stipulate too much, we are not qualified for that. Let’s leave the scientists do the job, and they are saying that animal farming is the number one cause of the planet’s destruction, along with transportation and then comes other everyday life things and stuff we buy, that we can, and should do something about.
For example: eating much less meat (why not, any at all if you are a little bit concerned by animal torture), riding your bike instead of the car (when possible), taking the train instead of the plane (when possible), using less (or no) plastic bags, very easy, and stop buying unnecessary crap etc etc etc.
Everything you do in your life is nothing more than a habit. It’s easy to change a habit. Excepting when it’s an addiction. Like meat and cheese can be. That’s why some people get really angry when they are suggested to eat less meat ;)
If you think by making no kids you are saving the planet, you are wrong. If you change your habits and you raise your kids properly, then you are making a difference.
Robert Omni says
Wow Oliver you just don’t get it.You sound like a person that has just joined a cult and want to prove to the vegan population that your fully brain washed and ready to kill some meat eaters.Calling people ‘little princesses’ seams very defensive and immature.You sound like a 14 year old child who got a new toy and is showing all the people it’s functions. Funny stuff.
Shane says
Yup. He’s kinda a jerk.
Oliver response:
What for saying facts I’m a jerk? I can’t say it more politely. I mean veganism is just the best, and omnivores are ruining everything. Link. Com, Link. Com. Etc. ad infinitum.
Olivier Girardot says
What we think of each other isn’t really important ;)
There is more at stake here. And I am sorry, but you do sound like a spoiled little princess when you complain about how vegans are annoying.
Zach Rose says
Vegans are annoying, they just think they are better then meat eaters. ITS A NATURE OF LIFE., Honestly i give 2 fucks about the whole vegan thing. I’m always will be a meat eater, and vegans ain’t changing nothing. They will always be more meat eaters than vegans and im pretty sure, the government ain’t changing the law for stupid vegans.
Olivier Girardot says
Why would you say vegans are better than meat eaters ? No one said that, yet you guys keep saying it. Would it be possible that you feel that way yourself ? Some kind of guilt or something ? I don’t know, I’m just saying, you guys seem to have an issue with that, some kind ox complex. Not my problem though, so don’t blame it on me ;)
“ITS A NATURE OF LIFE” it’s not because you write it in big letters that it makes it true.
Don’t worry, you will be eating meat all your life if you want to, or can’t quit it because because you are too lazy to help solve the World’s number 1 problem over your personal and selfish interest.
You have to understand, there is no way we can keep up with the meat and dairy industry. It’s just one of the most suicidal thing human kind ever did in the whole human history. And for what ? A small everyday pleasure ? By the way, it’s actually more an addiction than a pleasure, you should be aware of that. Look how you react to the idea of not eating meat anymore. You sound scared, even panicked a little right ? That’s your addiction speaking ;)
Anyway, like I said, you will be eating meat, but not from animals anymore: https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/lab-grown-meat-is-in-your-future-and-it-may-be-healthier-than-the-real-stuff/2016/05/02/aa893f34-e630-11e5-a6f3-21ccdbc5f74e_story.html
Guest says
Funny Oliver,the person who posted below me or you literally said it.
Paul says
Vegans ARE better than other people who exploit (or pay other people to exploit) fellow sentient beings for food, clothing and other now un-necessary purposes.
There I said it.
Wakey wakey. You are a worse person if you eat animals. Do some research, before you mouth off to other people, with your invalid opinions.
Guest says
Wakes wakey,most people are better than you who force some people to death via opinions and sacrifice their health. Hmm. Who’s the crueler one now?i shall not deign to even respond to any other comments.
Guest says
Oh a side note,this is exactly the morally superior thing that we’d like you to stop doing. Funny that we’re a worse person for following nature and our classification as an omnivore.sigh..perhaps the day where I lose respect for both groups is drawing closer.
Vannia says
Your articles are actually very helpful and really interesting. I’m glad that you wrote this.
I knew a few vegans a while back and while most were nice, there were these two that kept trying to force their diet down my throat. Even the other vegans thought they were annoying.
I’m not a vegan, nor do I have any plans to be, but I will look more into the subject of different recipes and types of choices. (Except Almond and Soy milk. I can’t stand those ever since I threw them both up)
Paul says
Olivier is genuinely hillarious.
He sounds like a complete zealot…
We evolved eating meat an continue to eat meat. It is not an addiction it is part of the vast majority of human life.
You are privileged to be able to wipe meat out of your diet, that is all it is.
There are vast swathes of the planet that do not have this privilege.
I for example enjoy vegan meals. I also enjoy meat. I enjoy a varied diet, I have no reason to give that up because some upstart zealot quotes and Links dubious biased material.
This is not the single greatest threat facing mankind, this is just a pretext for your zealotry.
No doubt you will respond with yet more utter tripe to show how you are ‘right’ followed by an emoticon.
You are the worst kind of zealot… A born again zealot. You spent the vast majority of your life contributing to what you saw as the greatest threat facing mankind and now feel you have some podium to lecture people on… You are a joke, your views ate laughable and your arguments are weak and arrogant.
I realise my comment comes across as arrogant, because that’s the only language you understand.
The rantings of an upstart zealot make for tedious listening and do more damage to a cause than good.
Olivier Girardot says
Your comment doesn”t come across as arrogant really… more like annoyed. And there is not a single argument whatsoever in your comment, so it makes it kind of easy for me to reply since there is nothing to reply to…
The languages I understand are: science, facts and common sense…
Whatever I am saying, is nothing I invented or imagined. So when you say I am a zealot saying bullshit, it’s not really me you are talking to.
LUIS MATAMOROS V. says
Oliver, biology, you have canines, frontal teeth for tearing and you were born with a gallbladder…If that’s not scientific proof for you we are born to eat meat then I dunno what to tell ya…
Olivier Girardot says
Haha ! Of course that’s not scientific proof dude ! I bet you just heard the canine thing somewhere and you are just repeating it. But you never read that in a science book right ? The reason for that it’s because it’s utter BS lol ! I’m sorry I shouldn’t make fun of you because it’s not your fault.
Horses have similar canines….. Real predators have much larger canines. Although Gorillas have huge canines, they only eat plants and a few insects. But no meat., and so on…
Listen, nobody knows exactly what we are “meant” to eat. There aren’t 2 nutritionists in the world that agree. The reason for that is that we are omnivores.
Omnivore doesn’t mean we HAVE to eat meat. it means that our body is able to process several types of food. Bears are omnivores too. And they go from 100% herbivore, to 100% carnivore depending on the race and the region they live in.
But we are not like bears. They are much more adapted to eating meat and hunting (duh!) than we are. There is no way a human survives with a 100% meat diet. On the other hand, not only we can survive with 100% vegan diet, but more and more studies show that we could live longer and healthier lives than meat eaters. That means something you know !
Listen, let’s cut to the chase: you want to prove that you “have” to eat meat. But you will undoubtedly end up to the conclusion that the only reason you eat meat, is pleasure.
And once you accept that, you will finally ask yourself the question that you are desperately (and probably unconsciously) trying to avoid: is it worth it ? Is it worth all the suffering, this environmental disaster, world hunger, water depletion, see pollution, and endangering future generations and life on earth ? No, of course it’s not worth all that.
Once you admit to yourself you only eat meat for your own pleasure. You will also understand why vegans get mad at people like you. There is nothing more annoying than people who can’t admit to what they are doing. You eat meat because you like it, period. We were meat eaters before, we remember ! You can fool yourself, but you can’t fool us, ’cause we’ve been there ;)
And let’s cut the crap with what is allegedly natural for us, nothing we do is natural anymore. You eat your several days old meat coming out from your fridge, and then you cook it and season it, there is nothing natural about that. If you canines were there for you to eat meat, you would want to eat it straight from the animal you just killed. Of course, you would puke 10 times before being able to swallow anything. How strange for an animal that is “meant” to eat meat, don’t you think ?
Guest says
Sigh. The canine thing is used in school education,I’m sure.
Paul says
You havent looked at much else on this website obviously… I came hre looking for this:
https://vegaprocity.com/2014/10/human-canine-teeth-designed-eat-meat/
Read it and weep. You are not a carnivore. You are a plant eater who has been tricked into eating other fellow animals.
Just because we can eat flesh does not make it right, or natural to eat flesh.
RY3Ry33030 says
HYellow my snbames Logan and i dont needs meats, i hbate all meater eaters and thgye shoulds all nbe killed off lapart froms trump hes my falcon lords, so basicly dies and leaves the naimsla alonge for evers3 or i kiwlill u
Peter says
Oliver,
You are still missing the point. The “facts you are stating” isn’t the problem. It is the holier than thou arrogance that surrounds what you say that is obnoxious and annoying. And just stating facts can be obnoxious in itself. It is true that wearing clothes with horizontal stripes can make overweight people look fatter. Telling them that is just plain rude. Your March comment about staying under water for too long is a poor analogy, and now that we have snorkles, scuba gear, and submarines makes the statement not so factual.
The fact that you have responded to nearly every post over the course of a year shows that you take yourself way too seriously, have way too much time on your hands, and are quite possibly a troll.
Try changing your attitude. People might find a new respect for you, and maybe they will even listen to you. You might find life a whole lot more pleasant that way.
Paul says
Your comment is not helpful to anyone in anyway.
F-
Olivier Girardot says
Soon vegans are going to be blamed for climate change because they didn’t warn people politely enough.
Guest says
Soon vegans will be blamed for murdering someone via lack of nutrition.
Olivier Girardot says
What ?
weewoo says
Why should there even be a debate? Let me eat my cheese and dead corpse in peace and I’ll leave you alone so you can eat your plants. End of story.
Olivier Girardot says
Were you just born this morning ? Do you really not know what this is all about ?
Listen, you are too far away from having clue, so let me just prepare you for what’s coming: if you are complaining now about people pointing their fingers at you and your food, it’s only going to get worse.
Jason B. says
Well, you are one pretentious little prick, aren’t you? A singularity of all the vegan obnoxiousness that has ever existed in the world.
Olivier Girardot says
No, that’s just your way of avoiding talking about the real problem. And you are just a handful thinking that about vegans.
Unlike you, most meat eaters don’t run away from the problem, blaming everything on the vegans.
I don’t know about other vegans, but I am probably more open minded then you on any subject. That is actually what brought be to veganism. Subjects like animal suffering, I am open to that, among every other suffering or discrimination involving humans. I am open to subjects like world hunger. Women, men and children dying of hunger because we (western countries) use their lands to feed our meat. And of course environment. Are you really open minded when it comes to these subjects, or are you just defending your steak ?
You think we are obnoxious because we don’t let you eat your meat in peace. But that is just being selfish. The only reason you want everybody to leave everybody else eat what they want to eat, is that nobody bothers you when you eat your meat, no matter the consequences. But when the consequences are that huge, and that you prefer looking away, and you put your own satisfaction before the rest of the world, well, not only you are being tremendously selfish, but YOU are the one being obnoxious.
But what we think of each other is irrelevant. What is relevant, is how are we going to reverse climate change, world hunger, water, air and soil pollution, mass extinction of numerous animal species, depletion of already 90% of aquatic life etc… knowing that the number 1 cause of all this is: livestock !!!
I am doing my part. Are you ? Or do you prefer focusing on vegan’s obnoxiousness.
Kellie says
Your ethics and arguments for veganism appear to be focussed on human well-being linked to long term sustainability of our plant Earth.
What are your oppinions on self-sustainability, i.e. growing your own veggies and raising craisins on a small scale? Is it more ethical to eat game, rabbits for example, than eating cows and pigs produced on an industrial scale?
I think its important to realise that sustainability is about doing to least harm, this means different things to different people (if they have an opinion at all). For me it means producing veg and eggs in my garden, eating locally and seasonally, cutting down on meat and eating meat only produced in my country, which has very strong animal health and welfare laws.
This is a much broader topic than you are willing to discuss.
If sustainability is your jam,there is far more to discuss than large scale animal production.
Kellie says
Chickens not craisins ha.
Paul says
Hi Kellie.
Yes it is a huge and wide issue. You are right, and it sounds like you are asking the right questions, that are leading you towards a Vegan lifestyle. This will dramatically reduce a significant amount of the problems that we have in the world today. Of course there will always be problems for us all to deal with.
I would encourage you to look into it more. The short answer is that Cows are the most harmful to the environment. Chickens are the most fattening to humans of all the animals.
If you killed the animals yourself, in a humane way, please tell us which one is better for you to kill?
Think about it. Go and see some live animals – not the pre packaged supermarket “meat” animals.
Trust your instincts and your heart.
Kellie says
Thanks for your reply and encouragement Paul. I am taking steps to reduce my meat consumption and could easily replace the milk in my tea with an alternative. However, for me, getting all my protein from a plant seems difficult to justify as sustainable.
You see, I live in a cold and wet country where the production in the field of high protein plants such as soy, lentils and quinoa is not possible. For me, it is better to reduce my carbon footprint by eating wild caught fish (MSC approved of course) for protein than eating imported grains that I can’t research the full life cycle of production, which is likely to be intensive agriculture – with high irrigation and pesticide and fertiliser use.
As for seeing live animals, I rent a cottage on a mixed farm that raises sheep, a small number of cattle and a bit of arable and forestry too. There are rabbits, hares and pheasants. There is also a massive push to improve the lifes of hens but not enough has been done. I believe there is only 1 factory dairy farm in the UK- but 1 is too many. I suggest you look up farming practices in Scotland and the rest of the UK and check out the EU regulations for best practice in agriculture. These are strict regulations that ensure animal welfare and restrict pollution emissions. I belived that the EU is more concerned about emissions from agriculture than any other country (i know the EU isn’t a country but it is useful for comparrison).
I know that there are farmers in the UK that care deeply for their animals, give them names and look after them into old age.
Cows and horses are used in forestry production not for meat, this also reduces environmental harm and is more sustainable over all, or should we get in there with the heavy machinery?
You also assume I’ve never seen an animal carcass, only prepackaged supermarket meat. That is not the case either, I’m not squeamish about flesh on the bone, whole rabbits and pig heads. I’m not a psycopath either. It makes me sad to know an animal has died so I can eat it. This is empathy that humans have towards each other and non-human animals. Empathy is why I and many others rarely eat meat, and why many people in the developed world have adopted your lifestyle too.
I respect your choice and your ethics, but I have my own for my own particular reasons. I hope you can understand that, I’m not asking for your respect though cos I know my way of life goes against your morals.
Also, I looked up this quote for you. I thought you’d like it. Maybe you’ve read it before.
“A day will come where the idea that, to feed themselves, men of the past did breed and massacre living beings to then expose indulgently tatters of their flesh in shop windows will inspire, undoubtedly, the same repulsion than the ones inspired to 16th and 17th travelers by cannibalistic meals of the american, ocean or african savages.
Levi-Strauss father of anthropology.
Can’t find original source so pulled it from here http://www.clementcharles.me/claude-levi-strauss-on-meat/
Wolf Eeter says
I am a veganvore…
I only eat vegans…
With some fava beans and a nice chianti…
*Insert weird Hannibal Lector hiss noise*
Olivier Girardot says
But, where do you get your proteins ?
Guest says
It’s a joke…Oliver….
Olivier Girardot says
Yes… mine was a joke too… ;)
PIGEON says
ill eat everything i stg i will i once ate 40 paper plates and 3 shoes ill fight you fight me you wieners ill eat it all ill eat your computers i will eat anything and everything
you see that car outside???? im gonna e a t i t
that vat of dangerous c̷̲̖̋́h̷̲̝̋͝ė̶̼͓m̸̭̌i̷̬̔̾ć̵͍̕a̸̟͘l̷̜̽͗s̶̮̒̈́??? IM GON a ̶̪̼͓̾̓͆́̀̐̀͝E̵̢̛̖̙̹̪̱̩͖͚̣̲̅̉̍̾͑͒̔̀͛̇̿͆̇̽͋͊͠ ̵̡̢̢̢̛̖̥̖̮̣̙̲̩͕̞̗̥̼̬͖͕̟͓̙̲̟̞̦̹̜͓͔̝̿̈́̀̐̽̿́͌̃͒̃̈́́́͗͑̓̎͑̎̈͋̕͠ͅa̷̢̧̨̛͇̘̣̜̪̥̦̬̞̤̮̣̱͙͖͙̽̾̓̓̏̓͠͝ͅ ̶̨̧̜̜̩͙̥̼̩̫̪͍̻̼͍͓̗̙͕̮͙̹̂̓̍̉͌͒̐͋͐̐̍͐͌̀̂̚̕͝͠T̶̢̡̢̨͙̮̙͎̰͚̘̟͇͚̮̘͓̦̲̘̦͔̯͎̹̣̹͈͚͔̜͍͚͐̌̎͆̉́̃̽̂̄͒͊͗̒̍̑̌̂̈́̓̒͒̚͜͝͠͝t̷̨̝̠̲̾ ̶̨̫̗̹͑̽̃́̈́̏͑͋̂͆͐̃́͌͝y̵̢̢͍͇͚̠̮̝͕̠̟̣̱̒͜Ų̵̛̦̜̺̟̳͇͕̞͍̗̦̰͎̲̩̬͇̣̼͙̥͖̹̭̭̭̣̒̆̐̀́̆̾͒̇͋͑̇͐̄͒̏̐̓̄̈͂̿́̅̐̊̔̆̋̚͜͝ͅͅ ̷̡̧̢̪̗̫̫͈͚͚̩̬̠͚͙̲͚̖̩̮̩͈̻͙̗̖͎̻̗͇̻̪͕̍͒͐̀̽͋̅̀̎͂̆̀̂̂͌͌̔͊̇̊̑́̄̚̚͜͠m̴̘͙͇͚̲͈̯̠̟̮͎͔͙̜̩̹̤̟̻̯̜̻̪̝͔̗̦̰͚̣̦̼̥̩̀̆ ̸̡̧̛̛̗̟̩͓̼̘͉̰̺͕͙̭̠̱̝̟̜̞̮̩͍͆͌̆͊͐̒̈̏́͗͛̑̆̒̾̉̓̏̾̌͛̕̚͜͝y̷̝̗̝̼̞̮̘͊̈́̏̀̈́͋̑̐̌̆̂͑̽̋͆͋̅̌̔̏̅͂̒̉̑̉̄̒͒̓͠͠U̶͙̳͔̝̩̩̖͚̹̞̥̼̘̖̟̬̍̑̏͑̍̈͊̒͐̔͂͗̀̑̓̂́̓̈́̈́̈̈̅̽̕̕̚͜͝ͅ ̴̼̙̦̜̤͎̬̘̩̰̖͓̲̤͇͉̯̘̘̝̖̟̳̫̯̩̥̔̔̊̊̉̐͛̈̍͂̄͘̚m̸̢̡̫͙̘͔̰̤̗̳͖͓̝͆̒̉͒͗̏̋
FOO D F O O D YOURE ALL FOOD IM GOI GN TO FEAST IM GOING TO F E A ST FE A ST ON EVE RYTHING I WILL Ȩ̶̧̜͖͓̗̞̻͕̝͚͕͎̤̲̘̅̍̿̽̔̈́̚͜A̵̡͉͎̱̫̥̾̏͊̿̅̈́̾͠͠ ̶̢̢̡̮͖͔̩̯̪̬̠͙̥͓̪͕̖̬̮̣̹̣̞̃͌̒͊́̈́̈͑͌͘͘T̸̺̝͍̯̙͕͖̪͍̫͈̑͜͜͜͝ THI S EN TIRE PL ANE TTT FE AS T F E A S T F E A S T F E A S T F̵̧̭̟͈̯̫͉́̐͊̕͘͝͝Ē̶̢͚̉̐͋̍̊̄͐̏Á̷̢̖̣̺͉̺̼̭͈͎̍̋̔̀̀͊̉̈́͐̏̀̇̆̅͛̋́̈̈͘͘͝͠͠S̵̬͓͚̳̮̍̅̾͠T̵̛̻̪̯̦͍̜̞̩̤͕̎̊̀͐̄̃̽̇̀̆̌̍́̃͌͜͝͝͝͝͠ FE A S T FEAST FE A S T FO O D FOOD EAT ALL OF I T ALL FEAST ON ALL
Malynda says
My question is, why does there need to be a vegan rephrase at all? All of those could be exactly the same as the last one: absolutely nothing. As long as no one is trying to force you to eat meat/cheese pizza, omelets, steak, gummy bears, etc., why would you need to make a point of saying anything about it in the first place? If you’re eating vegan food and it looks interesting to me, I can guarantee I’ll ask you all about what’s in it, how you cooked it, what spices you used, etc., because I love food and learning new recipes. I just don’t understand why you’d need to point at food that isn’t yours and say that you can’t eat it, when no one is trying to offer it to you to begin with.
Olivier Girardot says
We are talking about climate change, natural disasters, water depletion, sea life depletion, forest destruction, biodiversity destruction, air, soil and water pollution and so on…. We are also talking about billions of animals tortured and killed in ways no one could ever imagine until they see the footage.
And you are concerned about some vegans who point at meat and say that they couldn’t eat that ?
Well first of all, I have never seen a vegan point at another persons plate and do what you claim they do. And second of all, if you engage a vegan on the meat topic he/she wouldn’t just say “I couldn’t eat” that, he/she would talk to you about the tremendous strain the meat and dairy industry puts on our environment, and how horribly the animals are treated in the industry.
I often notice non-vegans being annoyed and offended by small things…. now THAT’s annoying.